Re: Rules Discussion: Did you know?

by **Solomon Gargoyle** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:11 pm

Tremere already have a ton of things they can do. Some of the rituals they have are pretty handy as are some of the more combat oriented paths. It says that unless otherwise noted that casting takes a full turn. Don't you think that could actually make Tremere insanely powerful? If they could use Cel that way I don't think they would have ever really needed things like Gargoyles. The other problem I have is this seems like very sudden rules change.

by **Story Teller** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:25 pm

Meh...Variety of skills versus quality of skills isn't an argument I want to get into.

The tremere are not insanely powerful. They are only powerful against non win all ties, and even then they still have only the same chance to hit them as they do to hit the tremere. You can have all the fancy spells you want, but if you don't have the ability to succeed in using it, or the ability to last long enough to get lucky.....you will fail.

At least if the tremere spends the time to buy up in the out of clan discipline of celerity, they might actually see some use out of it for keeping their range based power at range, where it's meant to be used. Your fear is a Tremere attempting to exploit the use of thaum, and celerity to hound an opponent until they are defeated. Well i'm sorry to say, but if a player doesn't have the cunning to figure out a way around that situation by using cover, or creative thinking, then they deserve to be run down like a dog and set on fire. The "Melee" Character probably shouldn't have been so specialized, and should have expected to one day face a Ranged based opponent.

by **Theseus Ahroun** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:25 pm

While the Tremere have a wide variety of things they can do with Thaumaturgy they still run into the same drawback that they always have had with or without the use of Cel. Thaum in combat is ultimately the casters mentals vs the targets physical and once you factor in the win on ties things start to stack up against whoever is using Thaum. I don't believe this is a new interpretation in this game as players have been allowed to use certain paths of Thaum and burn for Cel in the same turn and it didn't unbalance the game. Now clearly Thaum that requires concentration to keep up shouldn't be allowed in conjunction with Cel but instant effects such as activating Levenbolt or burning hands during the everyman then having there Cel action's aren't horribly o.p.

by **Story Teller** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:27 pm

Oh and this isn't sudden. Been this way since before you started playing with us.

Well, my work here is done. I'm off to play video games!

*Whoosh!*

by **Solomon Gargoyle** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:31 pm

Tremere are indeed powerful. They have plently of rituals and other things at their disposal they can use instead of trying to be a physical character like everyone else. They can do things like make you relent if they get your blood, they can KILL you outright with some rirtuals, they can create Gargoyles, go into the umbra, With Levinbolt they could hit you once and you lose all your cel actions, and have tons of other paths I've never even heard of. I completely disagree that allowing them to use celerity in this way won't make them overpowered. You don't need to always have celerity to stay at range. If your on a roof top for example, its kinda hard to get there with cel. You can't fly, unless your insanely fast your probably not going to get to that rooftop before the Tremere is gone, and running up walls is a extremely elder level power for Celerity.

by **Solomon Gargoyle** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:33 pm

Theseus Ahroun wrote:While the Tremere have a wide variety of things they can do with Thaumaturgy they still run into the same drawback that they always have had with or without the use of Cel. Thaum in combat is ultimately the casters mentals vs the targets physical and once you factor in the win on ties things start to stack up against whoever is using Thaum. I don't believe this is a new interpretation in this game as players have been allowed to use certain paths of Thaum and burn for Cel in the same turn and it didn't unbalance the game. Now clearly Thaum that requires concentration to keep up shouldn't be allowed in conjunction with Cel but instant effects such as activating Levenbolt or burning hands during the everyman then having there Cel action's aren't horribly o.p.

But those are paths that specifically state it doesn't take a full turn. I'm totally against allowing things like Firestorm and then Cel action to run away. Then why isn't the Tremere cunning enough to figure out how to drop a Firestorm in such a way the celerity monkeys can't get to him? It was never a problem in LARPs I played in. Tremere still figured out how to nuke Celerity monkeys.

by **Solomon Gargoyle** Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:46 pm

Story Teller wrote:Oh and this isn't sudden. Been this way since before you started playing with us.

Well, my work here is done. I'm off to play video games!

*Whoosh!*

Have fun then. Can someone possibly put up more of the house rules cause I asked about them when I joined and was only told a handful and more keep popping up.

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